Now that Rob has posted the Sockeye/Bravo finals, I had a chance to take a peak and I had some thoughts about it.
First off, I think the weather must have been an issue. A friend of mine was there and he said it was really windy. I also heard that Sunday was the first really bad day of wind and teams had potentially not adjusted yet and this game would be not as crisp as previous ones. With that being said I am sure that playing top shelf disc in said weather is difficult, especially offense. However, this is club nationals, this is Sarasota, its always this windy in the finals and these teams are the best. However, considering that they are the best in the world, I don’t think they played like it. This game looked much more like a college finals than anything else, I mean Bravo was down 5-3 and then went on a 4-0 run? Took half 8-6, but lost 15-13? That doesn't happen in the finals at Club Nationals. I wouldn’t call it sloppy but it definitely was not what I was expecting. Now, this is very presumptuous of me to say seeing that I am about 2 or 3 light years from this playing ability but I still have some observations.
When I saw that Bravo made the finals, I was really stoked. They made semis last year, a really good bunch of players, very experienced, very athletic, and so on. However, this was their first finals appearance and it was for the ability to play at World’s. That is a ton of pressure and I think it got to them. You have really stellar play from a lot of great players but there were also some HUGE mental mistakes like easy throw aways and hasty decisions. I don’t want to knit pick a team that just made the finals, but it just did not look like they played their best offense. I mean you have a team throw a callahan AND drop a pull. You look at just those two things, no way you predict Sockeye to win the game. That should be 2 easy breaks, which should be all you need at this level. However, Bravo tossed up some poor spittle and Sockeye made them pay.
This is by no means the end of the world for Bravo and I feel like this sort of loss has to happen for a team to improve. It has got to be damn near impossible to just swoop into the finals and win the first time, especially against a team that is playing in like their 5th finals, their 4th in a row. This is not dissimilar to the GOAT/Boston regional final I keep talking about. A great team has to learn to be great and situations like this teach them. It would be nice if these lessons can be learned verbally but I think that Chicken will be a better handler now that he has had a tough loss like this. I am sure every dump throw he tosses will be perfect from now on and a cutter going up the line better be DAMN open and NOT covered by Mike Caldwell for him to toss that outside in flick. I have had some really poor moments in my career and I can say that events like this really precipitate improvement, they haunt you forever but they make you better. That is how experience is earned and I will say that I think Bravo is going to be the team to beat next year. Sockeye will have to peak twice to win it all next year, something that hasn’t been done by the previous 2 world title holders. I think Jam or whoever else will give Bravo a game next year but the boys from Colorado will have all the tools to win it all in 2008, experience, athletes, and the memory of 13-15 silver medal.
Ok, Bravo lost, way to kick them while they are down Match, dick! Now for Sockeye. This is a weird team. There is so much footage of them so folks like myself have seen them play a lot, despite the 3,000 mile separation. However, they sometimes seem to play to their opponents, not their own game. Take last year for example. The 2006 finals was an extremely well played game. I remember watching the score reporter in lab and seeing that Sockeye had taken half 8-6. At that point I knew Furious was screwed and they were, down a few breaks to a team like Sockeye and your chances of victory are pretty slim. Elite Open ultimate is all about possession, ie not turning it over. These elite squads have the ability to play games with less than 10 turnovers, it is almost expected at this point. With that in mind I think Sockeye really wanted to beat Furious last year, a team that had sprung their proverbial bear trap on the Fish in the past. They played patiently, their cutters were on fire and they took advantage of a few Furious mistakes, not to mention 2 HUGE breaks in a world greatest and the Skippy hammer incident. However this year, not unlike 3 years ago, Sockeye was not playing Furious in the finals and they played less composed and more aggressive. There were many big plays, skies and hucks, but there were also A LOT of turnovers and layout Ds. Layout Ds are really nice, and in college they happen a lot because handlers are not as good. They see a guy and think he is open and a defender either makes up some serious ground or comes out of nowhere. In club though, these handlers are conditioned by years of mistakes so they know when to throw and when not to. In this game however, there were so many layout Ds, I mean watch last years finals and you will see some HUGE bids, but most folks came up empty. Valdivia, Beau, Jolian, Caldwell, JD all made great plays (although technically not a layout D by JD). But the throws that allow these Ds should not have been tossed in the first place. I suppose playing in the North East has made me slightly more conservative and it just amazes me that at this level, a game like this happened. Also, like the Sockeye/Jam finals there were a lot of turnovers, especially on game point. Double game point in 2004, I think each team had 2 chances to score. Last weekend, Sockeye needed 3 possessions at 14-13 to seal the game, and that is 2 too many. I mean Tim's outside in flick to Seth with Beau covering him? Really? On game point? However, considering the composure status of Bravo, its not surprising that they got it back and won the game.
Aside from being an ass, my main reason for articulating this point is that I think Sockeye has their work cut out for them at World’s. Japan is a really good team and they are going to take advantage of miscues like the ones Sockeye made on Sunday at nationals. Their defenders are top notch and if Sockeye thinks they can just play their deep game and hope to generate Ds here and there, they have another thing coming. I think they have the personnel, the time, and the motivation to be the best in the world but it is by no means a guarantee. There were a few points in that ECC final where the Buzz Bullets got pretty close to sealing that game and they will be hungrier than ever before next August. With that being said, I think Sockeye will be ready because they know what Japan is capable of. Wiggins exhibited an amazing amount of class and respect when he spoke with Rob after the ECC final regarding Japan. The Fish know their competition, and I wonder what their game plan will be.
Ok, way to bash the two best teams in the world, how about some positive points.
First, I was really impressed with Nord, he had a really great game, something like 2 goals and 3 assists. Over the last 2 years or so I wasn't sure if Nord was playing his best. He is so big, I mean the guy is like 6'5" and he is lanky as all get out. Chase is also tall but he is built like Brian Urlacher and Nord is more like Nowitski. Going into this tournament, I was curious to know if his size was becoming an issue and if he could move the way he used to. I mean if you watch the finals from last year, he just doesn't really make that many plays, which is fine, he was probably covered very well. However, this year, it seemed like he was back to his 2005 status when he had huge performances at regionals and nationals. He made so many great plays in the air and downfield, not to mention that he was just really heads up the whole game. Come on, that snatch and quick toss for a score? Someone was paying attention. I am glad to be proven wrong and it was really nice to see Nord dominant again. Hope that thumb isn’t too badly injured.
Another fantasy allstar in this game was Hector Valdivia. Wow this guy played well, on both sides of the disc. His quick huck score to Beau off a turn was absolutely beautiful, as was his SICK layout D at 9-8. I also like his scoop score from Popiel to take half. I really didn't know who he was before this tournament but I know who he is now. I also like seeing guys that can play all sides of the disc. I think he finished with 3 goals and 2 assists.
Another player that I think had a great game was Mike Caldwell. Over the years the only real thing I can say about Mike is that he isn't Roger Crafts. It seems like they look a lot alike, what with the shaved heads and facial hair. Plus Crafts is #2 and Mike is #20. However, this guy played awesome. He had a great catch to tie the game at 10s (his 2nd goal) not to mention his biggest play, which was saving Sam O'brien's ass getting an EPIC layout D after the dropped pull. I also know for a fact that Caldwell is an insane athlete (watch the celebration after Sockeye won it all last year and you will see him jump like 3 feet in the air) and it is nice to see him kick ass. I wonder if his son will be as good a player as Dad.
I think Chase had an interesting game. Most folks (myself) consider him a deep cutter because of his size but he was putting up hucks left and right. I also like the hammer he tossed to Nord (who skied Seth, his own team mate) for a goal. Interesting to see him throw the hammers in the finals instead of catching them.
I also like seeing Jolian Dahl and Ray Illian play well. I think both have tough situations to deal with in ultimate. Ray was a stud at Washington but didn't really have much of a supporting cast plus he had to compete with all the talent in the NW so he was overshadowed a lot. I think he is a great player and I don't think enough people know that. He had a great game with some great scores, skies and defensive efforts. Jolian is similar in that he has played with Beau for so long and they appear to be similar players, except that Beau jumped over a guy once. I will say that Jolian is straight up filthy. He is a GREAT player who carried Colorado at college nationals and seeing him get that hugtastic layout D on Sammy was really cool.
There were also just a lot of really cool plays to see in this game. Parker's out side in flick score to Whitaker (actually I think he meant to throw it to Beau) was awesome. Chicken's callahan was pretty cool. I didn't think TG would toss something up like that. It also should serve as a lesson to kids to work on their pulls. A back corner starting spot is not fun to work with. Richter had a nice layout score followed up by his patented head spike (I tried to get him to do it at the college nationals showcase game, but he wouldn't). I also like how Sammy quietly threw 4 scores. I also laughed a little bit when Parker claimed a disc was up when it literally bounced off the ground.
All in all this was a really entertaining game. I think many lessons were learned on both teams and I really think that Bravo is taking the steps to really become a giant in elite disc. And can I also say that none of my writing would be possible without Ultivillage. Thanks a lot Rob, you are doing a fantastic job. Aside from buying every UvTv subscription, your DVDs, and plugging you weekly in my blog entries, is there anything else I can do to support your company?
match diesel
Saturday, November 3, 2007
Sockeye/Bravo Finals Thoughts
Posted by Match at 6:10 PM
Labels: Alex Nord, Beau, Chase, Club Nationals, Johnny Bravo, Jolian Dahl, Mike Caldwell, Parker Krugg, Ray Illian, Sockeye, UltiVillage, Valdivia
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4 comments:
I usually enjoy reading your posts. I think you make some interesting insights and you also have that Skip Bayliss thing working for you in that sometimes I want to grab you by the shoulders and shake you violently. But I think that's a good quality about a critic, so well done.
While I totally agree with your assessment of the general offensive play being sloppy, I don't think you gave enough credit to the defense. I know a lot of people will say that any turn (with the excpetion of a straight up drop) is on the thrower and to some extent that might be true. But when you are facing a vicious mark and a strong crosswind I don't care how experienced of a player you are. Sometimes you just want to get rid of the disc. This results in discs being thrown low, too far in front or behind the intended reciever, all of which give the defender an opportunity to get a block. As a downfield defender, you know that staying close to your man can/will result in turns. In windy situations it is only natural that throws will be a little off, giving great players like Hector, Jolian, MC etc the chance to make plays. As a reciever as well, its only natural to slow up a bit as the disc arrives in a windy game. I've often told teammates of mine that in a windy game laying out can make all the difference, regardless of whether you actually get the disc. Look at Mac Taylor's absolutely filthy attempt on Nord right on the Bravo sideline. After having talked with him after the game he was reluctant but honest when he said he didn't actually get the disc, but his effort resulted in a turn. Because the throw was low, Nord had to slow up a bit to get down for it, giving Mac the chance to layout and force that turn. Defense always has the advantage in a windy game, and it allows athletes that extra split second to make a play on a slightly misthrown disc.
Overall nice writeup, especially coming from someone who wasn't in attendence, keep 'em coming.
I definitely think you are right and as I said when I started the write up, i wasn't there and cannot comment on how bad the wind was. However, i will say that last year there wasn't a turn over until the 8th point of the game and there wasn't a D until the 15th point despite numerous bids.
There were, however, 2 turns on the first point this year and had Nord not scooped up that loose disc, the first D would have been on the 2nd point. Technically the first D was Chicken's callahan (at least on film) on the 4th point. But again, wasn't there in '06 or '07 so I can't exactly say they were the same weather conditions. i just think that the games were drastically different and this year the finals were very different than I was expecting. Game was much for fun to watch however.
just a note about Ilian:
He had a pretty strong supporting cast at UW (including Ryan Winkelmann, also on Sockeye) and they did very well to make Nationals out of the NW after beating Brian Garcia's Berkeley team in the game to go (and finish in quarters after knocking out a very strong UBC team in pre-quarters, 17-16, epic game). They lost to Brown, who was pretty good that year. So...Ray's college career wasn't exactly toiling in the shadows.
For the 2006 finals, there was basically zero wind. For the open finals this year, the wind was up to 20 mph. That's a big difference, especially when it wasn't windy all tournament long to help players prepare. Not only does it make throwing harder, but as daniel pointed out, it also makes D easier. Both Sockeye and Bravo have outstanding athletes and are incredible defensive teams. I think without wind, the defenses would have generated more turnovers than last year's finals, but overall the turnover count would have been much lower.
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